Why do People Judge by Age?
I don't think the "how" vs" why" thing is an age issue. That seems to me like it's more of an interest issue.
The ones that just blindly memorize formulas don't care about the subject and are just going through the motions to pass the class.
The ones asking "why" and really trying to understand it are doing so because they have a genuine interest.
Age doesn't really have anything to do with it, IMO.
The ones that just blindly memorize formulas don't care about the subject and are just going through the motions to pass the class.
The ones asking "why" and really trying to understand it are doing so because they have a genuine interest.
Age doesn't really have anything to do with it, IMO.
closed account (N36fSL3A)
I think this topic is solved, but one question - is batch even considered a coding language? :|
coming to think of it, i have never ran into a 12 year old that wasn't relativley brighter.
(inbred Devonians don't count)
(inbred Devonians don't count)
closed account (N36fSL3A)
I thing Batch is a 'script-kiddie' language... I think its pretty ironic I'm calling anything or anyone a 'script kiddie' though.
But I think Batch is good to know.
But I think Batch is good to know.
closed account (iw0XoG1T)
I judge people by their age (Just so you know I am old). I really don't like when I am assigned someone who is older than 40--I find that they usually are incapable of learning.
Older people rely on skills that they have used over the years and are incapable of learning anything new. Yeah there may be exceptions to this rule, but I have never come across an exception.
The best stuff always comes from the young. It seems to me the people peak intellectually in their mid to late-twenties. You can meet a good craftsman at any age--but if you want new and clever get someone young.
It is actually hard for me now, I am definitely feeling my age. I use you learn everything so quickly and now learning something new takes a lot of concentration and practice. I pull it off at work, people think I am clever, but I realize that I am not what I was just ten years ago. I keep trying to learn new skills so that I can keep my mind young, it helps but it is a losing battle.
You very well may be smarter than people four times your age--you probably don't know as much, but you have greater potential. Anyone can memorize crap--that is called craftsmanship. But really doing something good takes talent and the only people with intellectual talent is the young.
People always want to emphasize the importance of hard work, but really hard work can only get you so far--you also need talent.
When looking for talent I look at the young--and I have had some sucess at finding it.
Older people rely on skills that they have used over the years and are incapable of learning anything new. Yeah there may be exceptions to this rule, but I have never come across an exception.
The best stuff always comes from the young. It seems to me the people peak intellectually in their mid to late-twenties. You can meet a good craftsman at any age--but if you want new and clever get someone young.
It is actually hard for me now, I am definitely feeling my age. I use you learn everything so quickly and now learning something new takes a lot of concentration and practice. I pull it off at work, people think I am clever, but I realize that I am not what I was just ten years ago. I keep trying to learn new skills so that I can keep my mind young, it helps but it is a losing battle.
You very well may be smarter than people four times your age--you probably don't know as much, but you have greater potential. Anyone can memorize crap--that is called craftsmanship. But really doing something good takes talent and the only people with intellectual talent is the young.
People always want to emphasize the importance of hard work, but really hard work can only get you so far--you also need talent.
When looking for talent I look at the young--and I have had some sucess at finding it.
| chwsks wrote: |
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| the only people with intellectual talent is the young. |
| chwsks wrote: |
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| (Just so you know I am old). |
If you have no intellectual talent, of what use is your advice?
| @Fredbill30: I'm 12 and I get a whole lot of idiots saying I suck |
| @chwsks: Older people rely on skills that they have used over the years and are incapable of learning anything new ... but if you want new and clever get someone young. |
@chwsks: you're forgetting talent is not enough. There is also that thing called experience and hard work. Experience gets better with age, while there is no reason for talent to become worse. That's why generally older people are valued higher.
You might think that people past 40 learn slower, but this is plain wrong. They are capable of learning new things just as young people are - the key difference is they have enough experience they *don't need to learn new things* so badly as youngsters do. They also may more often dismiss new things as not worth learning - because they have much more knowledge to judge properly. At some point of career learning yet another MVC framework or game engine library is really not attractive any more.
It may take you learn C++ 5 years when the only thing you know is batch, but it might take you a month to become proficient if you know several other languages in different paradigms. Experience is extremely important and that's why a 12-year old kid won't be paid a tenth of what a 50+ year old senior architect can make.
You might think that people past 40 learn slower, but this is plain wrong. They are capable of learning new things just as young people are - the key difference is they have enough experience they *don't need to learn new things* so badly as youngsters do. They also may more often dismiss new things as not worth learning - because they have much more knowledge to judge properly. At some point of career learning yet another MVC framework or game engine library is really not attractive any more.
It may take you learn C++ 5 years when the only thing you know is batch, but it might take you a month to become proficient if you know several other languages in different paradigms. Experience is extremely important and that's why a 12-year old kid won't be paid a tenth of what a 50+ year old senior architect can make.
closed account (iw0XoG1T)
| rapidcoder wrote: |
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| you're forgetting talent is not enough. There is also that thing called experience and hard work. Experience gets better with age, while there is no reason for talent to become worse. That's why generally older people are valued higher. |
I have not forgotten, talent is not enough to succeed; but those over 40 are should be in management where experience helps more than talent.
| cire wrote: |
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| If you have no intellectual talent, of what use is your advice? |
There goes my story, I begun as in 2009 (I was... 17 minus 2013 plus 2009... which is... 13), after 6 months I was really claiming I knew all of it and I was able to do all I wanted to.
But I was completely wrong, I hardly did ever finish any project.
This doesn't mean I didn't learn anything from my tests.
I learnt so much, indeed.
So, yeah, if I'd meet you, I'd say you're not experienced enough for serious work, for the moment (Probably not in a offensive way. I don't flame people unless people flames me).
It's hard to believe that once you are beginning, but I'd completely quote Disch's and Thumper's posts.
Just keep trying and gaining experience.
But I was completely wrong, I hardly did ever finish any project.
This doesn't mean I didn't learn anything from my tests.
I learnt so much, indeed.
So, yeah, if I'd meet you, I'd say you're not experienced enough for serious work, for the moment (Probably not in a offensive way. I don't flame people unless people flames me).
It's hard to believe that once you are beginning, but I'd completely quote Disch's and Thumper's posts.
Just keep trying and gaining experience.
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@fredbill, is batch like bash? is it the same scripting sort of thing? if I am learning scripting in bash does that make me a "script wrinkly" :D
Thas what we will all be when we are too old to see the console properly and want to break our grand-children's social networking crap so they visit us :P
Thas what we will all be when we are too old to see the console properly and want to break our grand-children's social networking crap so they visit us :P
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The wonderful world of insecurity. I've personally never worried about what people think of me. Though, sadly, I do let it affect my work. Until recently anyways.
@OP:
If you get a zeppelin, a cape, and goggles, and go explore the blogosphere like Cory Doctorow, suddenly you're just lovably eccentric.
If you get a zeppelin, a cape, and goggles, and go explore the blogosphere like Cory Doctorow, suddenly you're just lovably eccentric.
Let me just add this as my last statement.
@OP
Stop worrying about what idiots think and don't tell people your age. Even though I'm 31 years old, you wouldn't know that as for all you know I could be a well articulated 8 year old looking into programming (minus the fact I've been doing this for 16 years or so now). As for the names, don't worry about those either as I consider anything I am called a compliment. I am called a computer geek, nerd, binary pimp (idiot cousin), and a few others. Script-kiddie, though they mean it as an insult, it is really a compliment if you think about it because how many kids do you know that even know any scripting or what scripts are to begin with? To me that means you are an advanced 12 year old.
@OP
Stop worrying about what idiots think and don't tell people your age. Even though I'm 31 years old, you wouldn't know that as for all you know I could be a well articulated 8 year old looking into programming (minus the fact I've been doing this for 16 years or so now). As for the names, don't worry about those either as I consider anything I am called a compliment. I am called a computer geek, nerd, binary pimp (idiot cousin), and a few others. Script-kiddie, though they mean it as an insult, it is really a compliment if you think about it because how many kids do you know that even know any scripting or what scripts are to begin with? To me that means you are an advanced 12 year old.
| @chwsks That is the type of advice that sometimes comes from the old and experienced-- a young man might be foolish enough to ignore this and do something of worth. |
I have not forgotten, talent is not enough to succeed; but those over 40 are should be in management where experience helps more than talent. |
Nope. Many people don't like doing management. Management is boring. Also, having talent to code and design doesn't mean you have talent for managing other people. If you have a real talent for programming, after 40, you might be better a software architect / designer / specialist, which often *does involve coding*. And pays out just as well as in management, or sometimes better.
BTW. Many people after 40 just start their own business and *hire* other people to do management for them, so they can just do what they do the best: coding. Which is pretty funny - a founder of a startup may make much more money than the executive manager, who's paid only a salary, but doesn't have a huge share.
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| chwsks wrote: |
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| but those over 40 are should be in management where experience helps more than talent. |
+1 to rapidcoder's response to this. I would never get anywhere near management. I don't care how much better the pay is.
The idea that management is the natural progression of a career is kind of crazy. And to expect everyone over a certain age to be a manager (or to perceive anyone over a certain age who isn't a manager as 'unsuccessful') is absurd.
| BHXSpecter wrote: |
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| Script-kiddie, though they mean it as an insult, it is really a compliment if you think about it because how many kids do you know that even know any scripting or what scripts are to begin with? |
I don't think the term "Script-kiddie" is used to describe kids who write scripts. The ones who actually understand and write the scripts are more commonly referred to by more positive terms ("hacker" is the only one that comes to mind at the moment.
"Script-kiddie" is used to describe someone who shows off something they slapped together with premade parts and/or brags about all the stuff they can do when all they're really doing is leeching off of other people's work.
So no, script kiddie is not a compliment.