noobies rant

[kfmfe04]

wow, there are quite a number of noobies on this board who want to do GUI programming or pthread programming, after having studied C++ for a stunning HOUR or TWO!

how did this come about?

is it due to expectations arising from the ease of web or Java programming?

or is it just my fortune that I've never run into people like this in RL?

[rapidcoder]

I think it is just people want to get to the interesting stuff as soon as possible. Writing console programs is not that interesting if most of the programs you see have GUIs.

[ultifinitus]

What's wrong with pthreads? =]

gosh is

   pthread_t thread;
   pthread_create(&thread, NULL, &function, &parameter);

any harder than

   for (int x = 0; x < 1337; x++){
     cout << "Fail Train | | ";
   }

to a beginner?

And I've found GUI programming to be simple point and click stuff lately, tres facile!

Slightly more seriously, I'm not sure. Maybe it's the suggestions of the community, maybe it's the desire to do things quickly as you said, or maybe they just think that they should have the innate ability... one way or the other I don't think it's necessarily bad.

[kfmfe04]

@ultifinitus

hehehe - don't encourage them or I will have all of them PM you with their questions next time ;^P

@rapidcoder

that's too bad if it's true - I must be old school for preferring ncurses over GUI programming :^)

[rapidcoder]

What's wrong with pthreads? =]

Threads (not only pthread) are hard. It is not creating threads that is hard. It is synchronizing stuff that is. I think it is really much harder than manual memory management - and it is extremely hard to debug if you screw it up.

[Return 0]

This is nothing new to the forum. For at least the past 3 years it's been like this. People want to run before they can walk. Chalk it up to being young and excited about something (or plain dumb in some cases). All we can do is nudge them in the right direction.

[Albatross]

Yes, Virginia, there are people who would prefer to run before they know how to walk, which I think comes as a result from underestimating C++.

Although... GUI programming isn't necessarily very hard, depending on your library and how you go about learning. Thread synchronization, though, could be tricky for a beginner, no argument there. ;)

-Albatross

[kfmfe04]

@Return 0

that's exactly my take - I was just think that they were trying to fly before the could crawl

@rapidcoder

I think ultifinitus was just being sarcastic - most developers who have actually tried thread programming in a non-reentrant environment know it's non-trivial...

----------------------------------

maybe the next time someone is so impatient with C++, I will just redirect them to Java or python

[kfmfe04]

...and how many times a time can a noobie question be answered by saying, use atoi()?

I think about five times a day - next time, I will say: "use atoi()" without reading the question

[chrisname]

I'm going to beat Disch to the punch and say: so what? Out of learning via console and learning via something like Qt or SFML, I wouldn't say there was a clear "easier" way. It depends. If you're writing a program that just prints some text, you don't need a GUI. Just use the console. If you need the use of a mouse, or several controls, it's much easier to use something like Gtk+ or Qt than something like ncurses (though ncurses does support the use of a mouse, and you could implement buttons and things yourself). The point is, choose the Right Tool for the Job. I think noobies can start with GUI programs if they want to, as long as they start small. When they're trying to make an MMORPG with only 2 weeks of experience, though, that is where you draw the line :)

kfmfe04 wrote:

"use atoi()"

You shouldn't use the ato* functions any more, use strtol() or strtod() instead.

[kfmfe04]

thx for the strtol() and strtod() tip - I feel so old discovering that good-old atoi() is effectively deprecated!

I totally agree with:

Right Tool for the Job

unfortunately, some of these noobies are trying to build a space shuttle with their hands as the tools

[xander333]

I don't see the problem with that?
Most "noobs" who start programming didn't even KNOW they would be writing in the console for the first few weeks/months. I didn't atleast.

[anonymous23323124]

I suppose therefore the problem is not that they want to use a GUI, but instead the scale of the GUI project that they intend to create after said three weeks of learning C++.

That said, I also feel that when learning, it's important to have to brush over as few areas as possible. Writing a console application involves no use of classes, nor functions calls etc; on the other hand, most GUI programming will I would guess. Thus when learning about intrinsic variables, control flow, expressions and pointers etc., I don't see the harm in sticking to the console to keep confusing frills to a minimum.