Borderlands: The Pre-Sequel -- an honest review
So Borderlands 3 (aka, "Borderlands: The Pre-Sequel) came out today. Bought it and gave it a go. Here's my take after putting in ~8 hours of gameplay:
Let me start by saying I'm not a fan of FPS's... but I fucking love Borderlands. In fact, Borderlands 1 was the reason I bought my XBox. It was so satisfying to go around shooting bandits in the face. Plus there were tons of hidden pop culture references and in-jokes. Nonstop action, and a fun RPG/levelling system. So yeah, I got hooked. It wasn't perfect, but it was very fun. Single or multiplayer.
Borderlands 2 came out a few years later and I grabbed it immediately, and it blew me away. Not only did they improve upon basically everything, but they added a bunch of new mechanics, like slag weaponry and relics. They even realized many of the mistakes they made in the first one and fixed a lot of them -- the biggest of which is recognizing that Clap-trap was super annoying in BL1... and so they changed him to be self-mockingly annoying (and actually hilarious) in BL2.
So Borderlands 3 sort of had a lot to live up to. But not really. BL2 was damn near perfect. I would have been perfectly happy with more of the same. All they really had to do was not screw it up and I would have been thrilled.
Well... they kind of did screw it up. Not completely. But enough to where I'm not sure if I'm really going to seriously pick the game up again. In a way that's pretty damning -- I mean this morning this was one of my favorite video game franchises... and after ~8 hours I'm not sure if I ever want to play this installment again.
Here's the things they got wrong (in no particular order):
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1) No more pop culture references. BL1/2 slipped in people with names like "Bruce McClaine", "Rose Tailer", made Game of Thrones and Dark Souls references, etc. I didn't notice any of that in BL3.
2) Too much backtracking/walking around. This was kind of a problem in BL1/2 as well... but not nearly this bad. My brother and I were playing this game most of the day today and there was like a 15-20 minute stretch in the game where we didn't have anything to shoot. I didn't actually time it... but it was really long.
3) Jumping puzzles. BL and BL2 were no more complex than going up to bandits and shooting them in the face with a shotgun. There was a 'jump' button, but it rarely was necessary... and when it was it was a really simple maneuver. The only jumping puzzles were for hidden "vault symbols" that didn't really do anything other than get you 'badass' points (kind of meaningless) -- really just for fun little easter eggs for people who like that kind of thing. But never for anything necessary for the game --- and what's more, not getting them didn't make you feel like you were missing out on anything.
BL3 has you jumping platform to platform (forcing you to die/backtrack if you miss) all over the place. It simply does not work in this game. And the BL2 developers knew it -- in fact they went so far as to mock it in the DLC: One of the characters in the game complains "Jumping puzzles? Really? I hate these things" -- and then the game changes and completely replaces the jumping puzzle with a bridge you can just walk across. Not only is this exactly on the nose.. but it's also hilarious.
4) Waaaaaay, waaaaaaaaaaay too much dialogue. BL1 had minimal/no dialogue/plot. BL2 added a [stupid] story, but it was largely unintrusive to the game and, with the exception of a few key scenes, was skipable or ignorable. BL3 is flooded not only with a story that nobody could possibly care about -- but it moves along WAAY too slow. People talk for like a whole minute and say absolutely nothing. What's more... you have to wait for them to finish talking before you can advance. This is torture the first time I'm playing this game... I can only imagine how bad it will destroy replay value.
5) The humor is worse. BL2 was hilarious. That game still cracks me up when I play it. But with BL3.... I don't know if it's because it was developed by 2K Australia or what... but it just isn't that funny. The parts where you can tell they're trying to be funny are just annoying. The funniest parts were Clap-trap's action skill, and the warning message(s) it gives you when you select him at the start of the game.
6) The maps are way too complicated. This is similar to the "jumping puzzles" problem. Most of the time I just don't know where to go. The Goal Diamond shows up on my map and I can sort of see where I have to get to, but I just can't figure out how to get there. Borderlands isn't Portal. It's not about figuring out how to get from point A to point B. It's about shooting bandits in the face. When I have to interrupt my bandit shooting for a solid 5 minutes and look around the map to see how to get inside this building -- I'm annoyed. My brother and I actually had to stop playing and take a break for a few places where this happened because we were getting bored/frustrated.
7) Oxygen. BL3 takes place mostly on the surface of a moon. Some parts are inside buildings where there's oxygen, and other parts aren't. In the parts that aren't, you have an O2 meter that you have to periodically replenish... either by walking into specific areas or by collecting capsules that are dropped. Think of the underwater levels in Genesis-era Sonic games... it's a lot like that.
The problem is, this mechanic sucks. When you're in a heated fight (ie, the best parts of the game), it's just an annoying hassle to have to drop what you're doing and run to an O2 replenishing zone.
And when you're not in a heated fight, there aren't really capsules around to collect. Worse, when coupled with point #6... where you're spending all your time trying to figure out where to go... and you have to stop looking to go get some O2... it's just... UGH.
So what did it get right?
Well.. the laser weapons are pretty fucking cool.
Overall I'm extremely disappointed. It is by far the worst of the 3. I don't recommend it. At least not for full price. Wait until it comes on sale/for free on XBox Live or something.
Let me start by saying I'm not a fan of FPS's... but I fucking love Borderlands. In fact, Borderlands 1 was the reason I bought my XBox. It was so satisfying to go around shooting bandits in the face. Plus there were tons of hidden pop culture references and in-jokes. Nonstop action, and a fun RPG/levelling system. So yeah, I got hooked. It wasn't perfect, but it was very fun. Single or multiplayer.
Borderlands 2 came out a few years later and I grabbed it immediately, and it blew me away. Not only did they improve upon basically everything, but they added a bunch of new mechanics, like slag weaponry and relics. They even realized many of the mistakes they made in the first one and fixed a lot of them -- the biggest of which is recognizing that Clap-trap was super annoying in BL1... and so they changed him to be self-mockingly annoying (and actually hilarious) in BL2.
So Borderlands 3 sort of had a lot to live up to. But not really. BL2 was damn near perfect. I would have been perfectly happy with more of the same. All they really had to do was not screw it up and I would have been thrilled.
Well... they kind of did screw it up. Not completely. But enough to where I'm not sure if I'm really going to seriously pick the game up again. In a way that's pretty damning -- I mean this morning this was one of my favorite video game franchises... and after ~8 hours I'm not sure if I ever want to play this installment again.
Here's the things they got wrong (in no particular order):
---------------------
1) No more pop culture references. BL1/2 slipped in people with names like "Bruce McClaine", "Rose Tailer", made Game of Thrones and Dark Souls references, etc. I didn't notice any of that in BL3.
2) Too much backtracking/walking around. This was kind of a problem in BL1/2 as well... but not nearly this bad. My brother and I were playing this game most of the day today and there was like a 15-20 minute stretch in the game where we didn't have anything to shoot. I didn't actually time it... but it was really long.
3) Jumping puzzles. BL and BL2 were no more complex than going up to bandits and shooting them in the face with a shotgun. There was a 'jump' button, but it rarely was necessary... and when it was it was a really simple maneuver. The only jumping puzzles were for hidden "vault symbols" that didn't really do anything other than get you 'badass' points (kind of meaningless) -- really just for fun little easter eggs for people who like that kind of thing. But never for anything necessary for the game --- and what's more, not getting them didn't make you feel like you were missing out on anything.
BL3 has you jumping platform to platform (forcing you to die/backtrack if you miss) all over the place. It simply does not work in this game. And the BL2 developers knew it -- in fact they went so far as to mock it in the DLC: One of the characters in the game complains "Jumping puzzles? Really? I hate these things" -- and then the game changes and completely replaces the jumping puzzle with a bridge you can just walk across. Not only is this exactly on the nose.. but it's also hilarious.
4) Waaaaaay, waaaaaaaaaaay too much dialogue. BL1 had minimal/no dialogue/plot. BL2 added a [stupid] story, but it was largely unintrusive to the game and, with the exception of a few key scenes, was skipable or ignorable. BL3 is flooded not only with a story that nobody could possibly care about -- but it moves along WAAY too slow. People talk for like a whole minute and say absolutely nothing. What's more... you have to wait for them to finish talking before you can advance. This is torture the first time I'm playing this game... I can only imagine how bad it will destroy replay value.
5) The humor is worse. BL2 was hilarious. That game still cracks me up when I play it. But with BL3.... I don't know if it's because it was developed by 2K Australia or what... but it just isn't that funny. The parts where you can tell they're trying to be funny are just annoying. The funniest parts were Clap-trap's action skill, and the warning message(s) it gives you when you select him at the start of the game.
6) The maps are way too complicated. This is similar to the "jumping puzzles" problem. Most of the time I just don't know where to go. The Goal Diamond shows up on my map and I can sort of see where I have to get to, but I just can't figure out how to get there. Borderlands isn't Portal. It's not about figuring out how to get from point A to point B. It's about shooting bandits in the face. When I have to interrupt my bandit shooting for a solid 5 minutes and look around the map to see how to get inside this building -- I'm annoyed. My brother and I actually had to stop playing and take a break for a few places where this happened because we were getting bored/frustrated.
7) Oxygen. BL3 takes place mostly on the surface of a moon. Some parts are inside buildings where there's oxygen, and other parts aren't. In the parts that aren't, you have an O2 meter that you have to periodically replenish... either by walking into specific areas or by collecting capsules that are dropped. Think of the underwater levels in Genesis-era Sonic games... it's a lot like that.
The problem is, this mechanic sucks. When you're in a heated fight (ie, the best parts of the game), it's just an annoying hassle to have to drop what you're doing and run to an O2 replenishing zone.
And when you're not in a heated fight, there aren't really capsules around to collect. Worse, when coupled with point #6... where you're spending all your time trying to figure out where to go... and you have to stop looking to go get some O2... it's just... UGH.
So what did it get right?
Well.. the laser weapons are pretty fucking cool.
Overall I'm extremely disappointed. It is by far the worst of the 3. I don't recommend it. At least not for full price. Wait until it comes on sale/for free on XBox Live or something.
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Sounds poor. Then again, I couldn't really get into the first two. I found them a bit repetitive.
Repetition isn't bad if you're grinding for something - thank you, Diablo - but with Borderlands I could never get a handle on the loot. Like I couldn't discriminate between manufacturers and mods. Really, the only distinction I made was the different weapon types.
Have you tried Destiny? It's an opinion-divider, but I like it. It rips off so many games; Halo, Borderlands, Diablo. However, there's some fun to it. Story is hugely underdeveloped but the core mechanics are fun, both for coop and competitive player. Again, a little repetitive, but there's always the allure of rare loot to help you chug along.
Repetition isn't bad if you're grinding for something - thank you, Diablo - but with Borderlands I could never get a handle on the loot. Like I couldn't discriminate between manufacturers and mods. Really, the only distinction I made was the different weapon types.
Have you tried Destiny? It's an opinion-divider, but I like it. It rips off so many games; Halo, Borderlands, Diablo. However, there's some fun to it. Story is hugely underdeveloped but the core mechanics are fun, both for coop and competitive player. Again, a little repetitive, but there's always the allure of rare loot to help you chug along.
| Then again, I couldn't really get into the first two. I found them a bit repetitive. |
Yeah, they actually are extremely repetitive in a way. The entire game is just "go here, collect this item, then go here and deliver it" -- but you're shooting bad guys as you do it. If you want to feel like you're progressing a plot or actually accomplishing something -- then Borderlands is not the right series to play. The only thing that really progresses is you levelling up your character and acquiring better loot.
Where BL shines is its ability for customized play style. Aside from you having 4+ different characters to choose from, each having a different action skill ---- each character also has 3 different skill trees. On top of that, all the weapons, relics, shields, etc are randomized so every time you play it, it can be a different experience.
Despite the in-game repetition, I must have went through BL2 like 50 times.
| but with Borderlands I could never get a handle on the loot. Like I couldn't discriminate between manufacturers and mods. Really, the only distinction I made was the different weapon types. |
Yeah the manufacturer didn't really matter much in BL1. Hyperion guns tended to be the most accurate -- whereas S&P guns tended to have huge clips -- and Maliwan guns were elemental. That was pretty much it.
BL2 got a lot better with that, giving each gun brand a very distinctive personality:
- Dahl guns have burst-fire capability and very low recoil
- Maliwan guns always have a high elemental effect chance.
- Bandit guns have huge clips but slow reload times
- Jakobs have high power and fast fire speed, but usually smaller clips and high recoil.
- Hyperion guns stabalize as you shoot them (first shot is likely to miss, but as you rapid fire, the recoil drops to near 0)
- Vladofs have insanely fast auto-fire speeds and usually pretty quick reload speeds.
- Tediores tend to fire a little slower, but when you reload you throw the gun like a grenade and it explodes (making their reload time probably the fastest -- and giving you that extra shot)
- And Torgue... well... EXPLOSIONS? ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-YRyhqsUgag )
I've gotten so good at spotting loot in BL2 that I can just look at a gun and tell whether or not it's going to suck practically instantly.
| Have you tried Destiny? It's an opinion-divider, but I like it. |
Not yet. It has been recommended to me by numerous people, and I've heard nothing but praise about it. So I'll probably check it out some day.
I'm really sad to hear about BL3, I love the first two and in fact I'm playing BL2 through for the first time now. I'm a bit torn on the pop-culture references, hearing Clap-trap or Jack go on and on about the "double rainbow" every time I jump down that particular hill makes me want to shoot them in the face, (but then again that's probably the point).
Everything else you said about BL2 though is spot on. The improvements to the guns between one and two are amazing, I don't know what kind of demented genius thought up a Tediore rocket launcher but that right there is proof of how much love went into making this title! The jokes are great to, they are probably the thing most responsible for getting me killed in fact.
Sorry enough embellishing from me now. How do you think those of us who enjoy shooters would like it? Is it just that it strayed too far from the IP? Or do the times of "dead air" actually kill it?
Everything else you said about BL2 though is spot on. The improvements to the guns between one and two are amazing, I don't know what kind of demented genius thought up a Tediore rocket launcher but that right there is proof of how much love went into making this title! The jokes are great to, they are probably the thing most responsible for getting me killed in fact.
Sorry enough embellishing from me now. How do you think those of us who enjoy shooters would like it? Is it just that it strayed too far from the IP? Or do the times of "dead air" actually kill it?
@Disch: Have you ever played Serious Sam? I feel like it has the same type of humor.
| EssGeEich wrote: |
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| I'm sorry, I think I've seen this review somewhere else. |
I whipped it up myself. If there's a similar review somewhere I haven't read it. Though I wouldn't be surprised if it exists as these flaws are pretty glaring, so I must not have been the only one to notice them.
| Computergeek01 wrote: |
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| hearing Clap-trap or Jack go on and on about the "double rainbow" every time I jump down that particular hill makes me want to shoot them in the face, |
What's this? I don't recall this hill or that joke. Maybe I never found it?
Where is this hill and how do you trigger the dialogue?
| I don't know what kind of demented genius thought up a Tediore rocket launcher but that right there is proof of how much love went into making this title! |
I know, right?
Also: Tediore rocket launchers are the shit. Free rocket and reloads fast = awesome. Reload speed is a killer for most launchers.
| How do you think those of us who enjoy shooters would like it? Is it just that it strayed too far from the IP? Or do the times of "dead air" actually kill it? |
It's hard to say. Personal tastes vary too much.
It's not completely without action... I mean, there's definitely times when the screen is full of guys to shoot. But there is a lot of dead air too.
And, I dunno... the action didn't seem as 'crazy' as it did in BL2. Like in BL2... when you're in the Tundra Express (near Tiny Tina) -- in the buzzard camp -- if you turn the enemy reinforcement switch in that place... you are set up for like 15+ minutes of nonstop awesome action. Bandits all over the place... a dozen buzzards flying over head, etc.
I didn't get anywhere in BL3 that had anywhere near that same level of action -- though it probably was just because I didn't get far enough.
Though there was part in BL3 that was pretty heated. I don't remember where exactly, it was like one of the early boss fights. Though what made it heated was mostly because it was in one of the low grav places, so there's lots of high ledges that you have to jump up to, so you're exposed a lot... and you can't really see any of the guys unless you jump up.
| Lowest0ne wrote: |
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| Have you ever played Serious Sam? I feel like it has the same type of humor. |
Nope. Never heard of it before. Same style of game?
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Sort of, when I played Borderlands 2 I was reminded of it. Particularly, an enemy that runs at you with a bomb in its hand.
To give you an idea of the humor, the enemy that runs at you with a bomb has no head. It still manages to be screaming.
The gameplay is quite different though. It is more fast passed, shit just keeps coming at you and you shoot.
My girlfriend and I noted that most bosses in Borderlands looked like vaginas. If you want to hit the enemy's weak point, well, you can probably guess.
To give you an idea of the humor, the enemy that runs at you with a bomb has no head. It still manages to be screaming.
The gameplay is quite different though. It is more fast passed, shit just keeps coming at you and you shoot.
My girlfriend and I noted that most bosses in Borderlands looked like vaginas. If you want to hit the enemy's weak point, well, you can probably guess.
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Having played a few hours of the Pre-Sequel, I can confirm that the comic relief appears to be mostly gone.
There are jokes but they're just plain lacking creativity compared to BL2.
Minus the dry humor, the game seems to be Borderlands 2, on the Pandora moon, with different classes. I haven't experienced any dry areas yet while I have found some easter eggs. I think it's pretty cool so far... except for the incredibly dry humor... which I think is mostly dry because most of it is not original. So far, there's been one joke in the entire game that I've snickered at but come on... BL2 has you laughing your ass off 1 minute into the game! It's such a different feeling.
There are issues. I can't really pinpoint them but it just feels...... rushed? I dunno, it definitely doesn't have the same quality as BL2 does. I haven't played through the entire game though so maybe my mindset will change.
There are jokes but they're just plain lacking creativity compared to BL2.
Minus the dry humor, the game seems to be Borderlands 2, on the Pandora moon, with different classes. I haven't experienced any dry areas yet while I have found some easter eggs. I think it's pretty cool so far... except for the incredibly dry humor... which I think is mostly dry because most of it is not original. So far, there's been one joke in the entire game that I've snickered at but come on... BL2 has you laughing your ass off 1 minute into the game! It's such a different feeling.
There are issues. I can't really pinpoint them but it just feels...... rushed? I dunno, it definitely doesn't have the same quality as BL2 does. I haven't played through the entire game though so maybe my mindset will change.
| Think of the underwater levels in Genesis-era Sonic games |
Thanks for that leading right hook of nostalgia.
Never played any Borderlands games, after reading this though thanks for saving me the time of buying number 3.
| shooting bandits in the face |
You mention this phrase quite a lot, perhaps Red Dead Redemption would be a little more up your alley (You probably have it in your collection, but just in case :) I found the story line a little naff, but riding around on a horse in the west is pretty damn cool. And theres plenty of shooting bandits in the face, or that guy who cleaned you out from a flush on the poker table.
| Where is this hill and how do you trigger the dialogue? |
It's in that area with that town where everyone stays indoors because they have the "skull shakes" (the name escapes me for now, it's that town with the "Grinder" in one of the first areas that you meet the stalkers). Go through the Hyperion base and there is an area in the north side where the edge of the base is on a cliff that lines up with the road into that town. Slide down that cliff and Clap-trap or Jack will radio in with the dialogue from the double rainbow Youtube guy. I've heard Jack only once and I like to raid that base every time I'm in the area so the Jack dialogue may require a specific action to trigger it.
| Nope. Never heard of it before. Same style of game? |
Not really, Serious Sam is an FPS for those who love the FPS genre. The two really aren't that much alike, Doom or Duke Nukem would be a better comparison but neither one really comes close to Serious Sam in the "Non-stop fighting" department. Instead of sandbox type maps with pockets of a few dozen enemies you have linearly progressive arena style levels that have body counts of 1000+ each. It's definitely a cult fan-base.
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| NoXzema wrote: |
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| I haven't played through the entire game though so maybe my mindset will change. |
Did you get to the town yet?
A plot mission there is to collect 3 remote things that are perched on top of 3 towers. So you have to figure out how to climb to the top of them. Then you have to listen to more story. Then you have to meet Jack in some elevator and wait for him to tell you more story. That part was probably the biggest annoyance I can remember.
I guess BL2 had you doing some stupid time-wasting stuff when you got to Sanctuary, too. But for whatever reason it didn't seem nearly as tedious or drawn out.
Also.. there's an optional mission to race some stupid kid shortly after that. Don't pick it unless you intend to do it, because you'll hear an annoying "Blimey, I can feel my hair growing waiting for you to start!" message every couple of minutes until you actually do the damn thing.
It also seems like none of the goal diamonds show up on your map until after the character giving you the mission finishes their speech. BL2 did this a few times, too... but not for as many of them... and it just seems so much worse in BL3.
Like one optional mission where you had to collect some item for this drunk guy and bring it back to him. Delivering it is a different step than actually turning in -- and you can't turn in until after he finishes a big, boring block of text. So you have to give it to him, then stand around with your thumb up your ass for a solid minute while you listen to audio vomit, then turn in.
Little things like that really irritate me. I hate when games make you wait -- there's no reason for it. And BL3 seems to make you wait everywhere.
| Computergeek01 wrote: |
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| It's in that area with that town where everyone stays indoors because they have the "skull shakes" (the name escapes me for now, it's that town with the "Grinder" in one of the first areas that you meet the stalkers) |
Ah yeah the Highlands. I know where you're talking about -- and the Hyperion base you mean. I don't think I ever jumped down the cliff though. Interesting! I'll have to try it out. =)
| Not really, Serious Sam is an FPS for those who love the FPS genre. The two really aren't that much alike, Doom or Duke Nukem would be a better comparison |
Ah, okay. I wasn't a fan of either Doom or Duke Nukem.
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