Well, SFML is annoying.
@Naraku,
I will once I get home. I don't have SFML on my work computer. I don't see anything different that would matter, though.
I will once I get home. I don't have SFML on my work computer. I don't see anything different that would matter, though.
Are you using the pre built binaries our did you build yourself? I ran across a thread that suggested an incompatibility with the crt.
Prebuilt. I hate building libraries on windows, and I don't know if the issue happens on *nix as I haven't tested it on my Linux VM.
This has to be something on your end. I just tested the code I posted with Code::Blocks (I assume your still using CB) using the pre built binaries and it ran fine.
The internet isn't really designed for the thin skinned. There are going to be "ass hats" in every forum including this one.
Yes, but the problem is that the entire SFML site is ass hats that treat you like you are retarded or stupid. Ass hats at other sites just are jerks and seldom act like you are stupid. I've seen my share of ass hats on countless forums and SFML is the only one I've ever been to that makes it sound like you are stupid because you don't understand the code or documentation and give you the custom 'RTFM' reply.
| "ass hat" is a weird/funny term. |
Not at all, it is another way of saying (at least for me) that they have their heads up their ass. Though I'm sure others translate it differently.
@BHXSpecter I've never gotten that impression from the SFML forum, granted I'm not there too often.
I have two accounts on the forums there. First one I haven't used in a long time because of them being ass hats. They give the same posts every time I asked questions "You're stupid, did you RTFM?" Seems a little dumb to have a forum for help and then treat the new users like retards. Resident Biscuit has the exact responses I got when asking question. Though I did make a new account to reply (I fibbed a little as I had the same issue RB had only it was mid last year, but said it was recent). I've gone back to Allegro 5 and messing with SDL in place of SFML now.
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@BHXSpecter First off, no one in the thread ResidentBiscuit started at SFML did anything to remotely question his intelligence. If anything, he over reacted to their comments. I'm sorry but RTFM is a valid response to a so called programmer. To put it another way, if you want to consider yourself a programmer, dont expect anyone to hold your hand. Oh, and creating an account to rant about how "useless" that forum is quite reminiscent of a certain someone.
I don't remember the password and the email is no longer active, otherwise I would have ranted in my first account.
Then apparently I'm misinterpreting them too because this reply seems to have a "are you retarded or lazy" tone to it:
Also, if the reply is always RTFM then there would be no need for a forum as the manual would explain everything so therefore the forum is useless. Resident Biscuit isn't the only one that has read their documentation and asked questions to just get a RTFM as the answer. The forums is supposed to be for helping people using SFML and RTFM isn't helpful. What you are forgetting, and they apparently are too, is that not all SFML users are seasoned programmers who will sit and read through long documents to learn it, they are just wanting to use it to get into game development or wanting to learn to make games while learning C++.
I will never understand forums that say they will help people then only reply you get is RTFM and the "don't expect anyone to hold your hand" because if they don't have someone there to help them how are they supposed to learn it? Ass hat, in my opinion, also applies to all programmers who have gotten too experienced and forgot how hard it is for new programmers to learn programming and get this attitude toward new programmers. I enjoyed learning to program, and love helping others learn without ever giving the "RTFM" as my answer, but it seems I'm part of the rare programmers due to RTFM being the standard online now.
| If anything, he over reacted to their comments. |
Then apparently I'm misinterpreting them too because this reply seems to have a "are you retarded or lazy" tone to it:
| According to the documentation you are doing something wrong: window.clear() If you looked through the examples provided with SFML and understood every line of code and what they do, you would notice something different about yours. If you do not have time to understand what is so significant in the 3 lines of code I quoted although you have read the documentation, I cannot help you further. |
Also, if the reply is always RTFM then there would be no need for a forum as the manual would explain everything so therefore the forum is useless. Resident Biscuit isn't the only one that has read their documentation and asked questions to just get a RTFM as the answer. The forums is supposed to be for helping people using SFML and RTFM isn't helpful. What you are forgetting, and they apparently are too, is that not all SFML users are seasoned programmers who will sit and read through long documents to learn it, they are just wanting to use it to get into game development or wanting to learn to make games while learning C++.
I will never understand forums that say they will help people then only reply you get is RTFM and the "don't expect anyone to hold your hand" because if they don't have someone there to help them how are they supposed to learn it? Ass hat, in my opinion, also applies to all programmers who have gotten too experienced and forgot how hard it is for new programmers to learn programming and get this attitude toward new programmers. I enjoyed learning to program, and love helping others learn without ever giving the "RTFM" as my answer, but it seems I'm part of the rare programmers due to RTFM being the standard online now.
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If you want to read "retarded or lazy" from that slightly rude quote then so be it.
And what you are forgetting is that SFML (and really any library) isn't geared towards new programmers, and why should it. I personally do not want documentation to read like an intro to programming book.
| What you are forgetting, and they apparently are too, is that not all SFML users are seasoned programmers who will sit and read through long documents to learn it, they are just wanting to use it to get into game development or wanting to learn to make games while learning C++. |
| And what you are forgetting is that SFML (and really any library) isn't geared towards new programmers, and why should it. I personally do not want documentation to read like an intro to programming book. |
On the contrary, I've been doing this going on 16 years now and I still remember when I got into programming. Sitting in front of my mom's gateway computer when I was 15, working under Windows 95 using DJGPP with RHIDE and C++ for DUMMIES during the summer of '96. I don't expect documents to read like intro books, but it has astonished me, looking back, at how drastically forums changed in regards to how they treated new programmers as their experience grew. I've watched 'newb' friendly sites go to RTFM because users felt they were too good to answer 'newb' questions any more due to it being under their experience level. I'm fully aware that libraries aren't geared toward new programmers, otherwise every language would be simple to learn and there would be no need for this site or any other language specific site.
Problem is that most of the time, when someone says they want to start making a game, someone always says SFML (or Unity seems to be another popular recommendation for quick prototyping without a lot of coding). I think SDL would be a better recommendation as it has far more tutorials to find (Lazyfoo's tutorials seeming to be the most recommended).
This site, I've been told, is the best place to come to get and give C++ help/advice. Though, if there were rude replies to questions like that, I would wonder how long this site would be recommended as the best C++ help/advice site.
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@BHXSpecter I may have been a bit overly aggressive before, I apologize for that. But I think its a bit extreme to say the entire forum is a waste. There always going to be ass holes but there are also people that want to help.
| naraku9333 wrote: |
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| @BHXSpecter I may have been a bit overly aggressive before, I apologize for that. |
No, not at all. I just considered this a discussion, haven't felt like you were aggressive at any point.
| naraku9333 wrote: |
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| But I think its a bit extreme to say the entire forum is a waste. There always going to be ass holes but there are also people that want to help. |
Yeah, I understand that as I know I've had my share at Flipcode.com, gamedev.net, allegro.cc, and numerous other sites. Though, it seems the more forums I'm part of the more I see comments like Resident Biscuit's about the way SFML members respond to threads seeking help. While every site has ass holes, it seems SFML has an over abundance of them. I'm not trying to be controversial or start a flame war, just stating my personal opinion on this matter. Fact is that their replies are why I went back to Allegro 5 and started recently learning SDL because it got to the point where I never knew if my questions would be advanced enough to keep the replies proper or be newb-ish enough to get rude remarks. I've never had a worse experience at any other forum than I did at SFML. That is probably why I understand Resident Biscuit's frustration with them so well.
@Naraku,
I did "RTFM", actually. I don't ask questions unless the documentation is of no help, as my problem was. The issue was with the 2.0 RC and an incompatibility with my machine I've yet to figure out. ASFAIK, nowhere in the documentation does it even mention this. Therefore, I asked a question. If that isn't the point of a forum, then please enlighten me.
I did "RTFM", actually. I don't ask questions unless the documentation is of no help, as my problem was. The issue was with the 2.0 RC and an incompatibility with my machine I've yet to figure out. ASFAIK, nowhere in the documentation does it even mention this. Therefore, I asked a question. If that isn't the point of a forum, then please enlighten me.
And also, it seems as if SFML is actually geared towards new programmers. The amount I work it does for you is almost annoying. There's way too much stuff going on behind the scenes, which have been the cause of my only two problems dealing with this library. All also after I switched to 2.0.