Request: Report LB for abuse
Ideally I would like it if nonsense posts weren't even allowed, but I think that I am in the minority here, so I am strategically voting instead to have posts in the lounge not count toward users' post counts.
If this discussion reaches a favorable conclusion I'll contact twicker about it.
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I am neither for, nor against your suggestion, LB, however I would like to give my own: how about if the lounge post count was subtracted instead of being added to the final post count?
Mwhuahaha. *looks at devon*
Mwhuahaha. *looks at BHX resurrected*
*tries to high-five cire, but cire just stares with a frown*
Mwhuahaha. *looks at devon*
Mwhuahaha. *looks at BHX resurrected*
*tries to high-five cire, but cire just stares with a frown*
Does from Lounge count? If so, I agree that these could be turned off. I don't mind really, but if majority will be against...
Post counts mean nothing toward experience in programming and serve no purpose on this site so they should be removed altogether. Why keep something that has nothing to do with the site?
@LB You realize your post is contradicting? The post count means nothing, but you are wanting twicker to implement something that affects that which means nothing with the logic it will hopefully curve spam (which it won't) and remove the idea that high post counts mean experience. This is why I say just do away with it totally then there is no favorites due to post count and every one will be on a level field. Those who want to post in the Lounge can and those who want to help can.
Keep in mind though, once this issue is fixed you and others will find new things to find faults in. For example, remove post counts so there is no false experience notions but then you are faced with spam still.
@LB You realize your post is contradicting? The post count means nothing, but you are wanting twicker to implement something that affects that which means nothing with the logic it will hopefully curve spam (which it won't) and remove the idea that high post counts mean experience. This is why I say just do away with it totally then there is no favorites due to post count and every one will be on a level field. Those who want to post in the Lounge can and those who want to help can.
Keep in mind though, once this issue is fixed you and others will find new things to find faults in. For example, remove post counts so there is no false experience notions but then you are faced with spam still.
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I think LB's point was not about reducing spam, but was helping to maintain a loose correlation between post count and trustworthiness.
If Joe makes 1000 posts in the C++ board and 10 in the Lounge
and Bob makes 1000 posts in the Lounge and 10 on the C++ board
And they both reply to ImANoobie's question... both answers will appear to carry equal weight, even though Joe's answer should probably carry more since he has more forum experience.
If Joe makes 1000 posts in the C++ board and 10 in the Lounge
and Bob makes 1000 posts in the Lounge and 10 on the C++ board
And they both reply to ImANoobie's question... both answers will appear to carry equal weight, even though Joe's answer should probably carry more since he has more forum experience.
I agree, since post count has become an unofficial sign of veteranship and experience.
@BHX @Disch I mean that if nonsense posts do not count toward a user's post count I will not be as inclined to report them as spam. I am very confident that this will make sargon and ne555 happy (they will get to keep their opinions).
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> I and many other forum-goers use post count as a quick and easy way to determine credibility
> Joe's answer should probably carry more since he has more forum experience.
> post count has become an unofficial sign of veteranship and experience.
and that's terrible.
@LB: yes, you should stop abusing the `Report' button
> Joe's answer should probably carry more since he has more forum experience.
> post count has become an unofficial sign of veteranship and experience.
and that's terrible.
@LB: yes, you should stop abusing the `Report' button
It's not a bad idea to get rid of the post counts totally but we can't really do it because it's a combination of post count and name recognition that lend people credibility. The post count is what stops me from creating an account named Dicsh and pretending to be a certain other member of this site. If we relied solely on name recognition then the human brain would auto correct and process that in the more familiar arrangement of those letters.
How about instead of limiting post counts or doing anything that actually involves real work; twicker just ignores reports from the lounge. We keep the same system in place where if an established user reports a brand new account then the post gets deleted but otherwise they don't count against the other user.
If no one else is going to say it though, I will. Both parties need to lighten up a lot. The first party needs to not report users and then try to rationalize that my post of +1 Banana to a user who hasn't been seen around here in years had anything to do with a thread about nothing. And the other parties involved need to stop taking something like being reported so seriously. Case in point I've been reported dozens of times in threads for being a jerk and I've undoubtedly deserved the majority of them but I'm still here. It's definitely not an "X number of strikes an your out" kind of system so there is no reason to harangue LB over it. What are you all worried about?
How about instead of limiting post counts or doing anything that actually involves real work; twicker just ignores reports from the lounge. We keep the same system in place where if an established user reports a brand new account then the post gets deleted but otherwise they don't count against the other user.
If no one else is going to say it though, I will. Both parties need to lighten up a lot. The first party needs to not report users and then try to rationalize that my post of +1 Banana to a user who hasn't been seen around here in years had anything to do with a thread about nothing. And the other parties involved need to stop taking something like being reported so seriously. Case in point I've been reported dozens of times in threads for being a jerk and I've undoubtedly deserved the majority of them but I'm still here. It's definitely not an "X number of strikes an your out" kind of system so there is no reason to harangue LB over it. What are you all worried about?
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@Disch
I know, but part of his argument was also the spam so I was trying to cover both too. His argument was that people who post in the Lounge either get no posts for posting there or Catfish666 said to make it take off posts.
The Doctor Who discussion of who was a better actor would be considered by some to be spam while others wouldn't consider it that. Last year I saw people complain because users ask programming questions for other languages in the Lounge.
So if everyone has a set idea of what is appropriate for the Lounge and what is not (which is different from person to person). Then one could assume the Lounge is a bad thing for the site and just remove it and make the site focus entirely on C++. So I say just remove post counts to remove the issue of false experience, then remove the Lounge to fix the issue of spam (though you have to remember spam was in the C++ boards too so it is everywhere).
EDIT: sorry was distracted typing that argument.
I know, but part of his argument was also the spam so I was trying to cover both too. His argument was that people who post in the Lounge either get no posts for posting there or Catfish666 said to make it take off posts.
The Doctor Who discussion of who was a better actor would be considered by some to be spam while others wouldn't consider it that. Last year I saw people complain because users ask programming questions for other languages in the Lounge.
So if everyone has a set idea of what is appropriate for the Lounge and what is not (which is different from person to person). Then one could assume the Lounge is a bad thing for the site and just remove it and make the site focus entirely on C++. So I say just remove post counts to remove the issue of false experience, then remove the Lounge to fix the issue of spam (though you have to remember spam was in the C++ boards too so it is everywhere).
EDIT: sorry was distracted typing that argument.
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> and that's terrible.
I agree, but it seems to be the current internet standard. It's quite difficult to match the success of stack exchange on commonplace forum software.
@thread: I am against complete removal of post count - it's decently reliable, and outliers are few enough in number to be easily noticed. (Assuming lounge posts do not take part in the post count calculation).
An issue I am concerned about is whether our post counts are going to be updated or left the same - I would prefer if they were recalculated.
I agree, but it seems to be the current internet standard. It's quite difficult to match the success of stack exchange on commonplace forum software.
@thread: I am against complete removal of post count - it's decently reliable, and outliers are few enough in number to be easily noticed. (Assuming lounge posts do not take part in the post count calculation).
An issue I am concerned about is whether our post counts are going to be updated or left the same - I would prefer if they were recalculated.
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| @thread: I am against complete removal of post count - it's decently reliable, and outliers are few enough in number to be easily noticed. |
+1
@thread: I am against complete removal of post count - it's decently reliable, and outliers are few enough in number to be easily noticed. |
Then your solution is no solution because a person can up their post count in the C++ boards just as easy as they could in the Lounge. A user could easily go through different posts and reply with "I never knew that. I'll have to make note of it and try it out." just to up his count. The post count in no way shows anything about experience or being a veteran, but just shows you post a lot to the site (and not necessarily in the C++ boards).
There has to be a middle ground, but I honestly can't see what it is.
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Outside of the lounge, writing "I never knew that. I'll have to make note of it and try it out." is a post I would consider spam, as it does nothing to contribute to the thread (unless someone was correcting you on a previous post and you are thus accepting the correction). It's sort of like stack overflow's policy of not writing "thanks!" or "me too!".
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I don't like post counts and badges and stuff anyway... but I agree with LB's suggestion -- posts in the Lounge should not contribute to one's post count.
I don't think we should discourage "It worked, Thanks!" or similar one-liner posts. I personally like to know whether or not an answer I supplied actually solved the posters problem.
I don't really have a strong opinion on this topic, but it sounds to me like there's discussion about a theoretical problem that isn't really a problem. I don't think people are intentionally inflating their post counts to seem more credible. I see very little evidence of that happening on these boards.
What I do see... and what I think the point of this thread might be.... is that Lounge posts tend to be non-technical.... yet post count in other boards is seen as a gauge in technical knowledge.
So Lounge posts artificially make a user seem more credible. The difference is.... I don't think that's intentional on the part of the poster. I think it's just a byproduct.
Of course I think we can all agree that, post count is not an ideal gauge... but it currently is the only immediate gauge for newbies. I don't think the goal in this thread is to make a bullet-proof, unexploitable reputation system for the forums. It's just to employ is simple change that'll level things out.
With that in mind, I think LB's suggestion of simply "not counting" Lounge posts is a very rational and realistic approach to the issue. You can poke holes in it if you try hard enough... but at the end of the day it more or less does what he would intend it to.
I have no beefs with this suggestion. Though I personally don't care enough to avidly support it.
I don't really have a strong opinion on this topic, but it sounds to me like there's discussion about a theoretical problem that isn't really a problem. I don't think people are intentionally inflating their post counts to seem more credible. I see very little evidence of that happening on these boards.
What I do see... and what I think the point of this thread might be.... is that Lounge posts tend to be non-technical.... yet post count in other boards is seen as a gauge in technical knowledge.
So Lounge posts artificially make a user seem more credible. The difference is.... I don't think that's intentional on the part of the poster. I think it's just a byproduct.
Of course I think we can all agree that, post count is not an ideal gauge... but it currently is the only immediate gauge for newbies. I don't think the goal in this thread is to make a bullet-proof, unexploitable reputation system for the forums. It's just to employ is simple change that'll level things out.
With that in mind, I think LB's suggestion of simply "not counting" Lounge posts is a very rational and realistic approach to the issue. You can poke holes in it if you try hard enough... but at the end of the day it more or less does what he would intend it to.
I have no beefs with this suggestion. Though I personally don't care enough to avidly support it.
| Disch wrote: |
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| I don't think we should discourage "It worked, Thanks!" or similar one-liner posts. I personally like to know whether or not an answer I supplied actually solved the posters problem. |
I appreciate your support by the way - you certainly cared enough to write the post ;)
I have been considering my request to recalculate post counts - unfortunately I am fraid this may be infeasible as there are many, many users and many, many posts in the lounge. If it can be done, that would be amazing.
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Anybody who has been on internet forums for a while knows a high post count doesn't make a person more credible.
Not counting lounge posts seems fine to me.
The only thing I think when I see a high post count is that somebody has been on a forum for a long time.
Not counting lounge posts seems fine to me.
The only thing I think when I see a high post count is that somebody has been on a forum for a long time.
| Garion wrote: |
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| The only thing I think when I see a high post count is that somebody has been on a forum for a long time. |